Author Topic: Ringed and Pseudoringed Galaxies  (Read 180415 times)

EricFDiaz

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #15 on: April 05, 2008, 03:07:14 am »
Note: Going through some of my postings, I noticed that I had made a few errors in classifications of the galaxies. I have since corrected all of the errors.

Originally, I only intended to post a few examples as visual aids to help GZ members better understand the articles that I had posted. I never intended this thread to develop into what it is becoming. Therefore, since I am posting SDSS images, from now on I will be including the reference numbers of each galaxy. Even though the images were posted before by other people, I don't feel it's duplication simply because all of the objects were classified incorrectly and consequently put in the wrong thread. I hope this is OK with the zookeepers. If not, then please let me know. Thank you. :)

Eric

P.S.

Just a reminder but for those interested in this topic and who have been following this thread....I would just like to let you know that I have posted more information and links in the second post at the beginning of this thread. I will continue to post more information and/or links in the second post as I find it.

Hmmm !  This is very interesting turn of a thread.

So, if this topic is the place to put all "ringed" galaxy posts instead of putting them in "The Ring Galaxy" thread, how to we cleanse that thread of the "ringed" posts ?

I could move my "ringed" galaxy posts, since I have been keeping track of them in my off-line log sheets, but for other posts ?

Also, should the "Ring Galaxy" thread, this new thread, and possibly the "Possible Polar Ring Galaxy" thread be moved to one location in the Zoo, just for ease of finding things about rings ?

regards,  diaswa


Hi Diaswa,

Those are all very good questions. As for the "Ring Galaxy" thread, which I think we can agree is a real mess--maybe 5% of the posts are actually "ring" galaxies--I don't know what to say. I just started this thread because it's something in which I'm interested, and also because I thought it might be of help to other members who were not clear about the difference between "ring" and "ringed" galaxies. But this is something that I haven't discussed with the zookeepers. Also, I don't know what the goals will be in Galaxy Zoo II and if this thread will even be relevant.

The galaxies in this thread are galaxies that are still in their star production phase, which brings us to another problem. Many of the "ringed" galaxies posted in the "Ring Galaxy" thread are lenticular (S0) galaxies, which technically would not fall into the category of pseudorings. So, they wouldn't really belong in here. And, even though I am one of those who believe that, at least some lenticular galaxies with rings, were at one time spirals with pseudoring phenomena occurring in them and that the rings contained in these lenticular galaxies are remnants of the rings formed in them through pseudoring while they were still spirals, there's no way at this time to demonstrate that that's even possible, much less true. When I had raised this question awhile back, zookeeperKevin pointed out that at this time in history even the fastest supercomputer in the world would be too slow to create a meaningful computer model that would show that this was even possible. Many of those ringed lenticular galaxies in the "Ring Galaxy" thread could I suppose be put in the lenticular (S0) galaxy thread, which I created a few months ago. But, then that begs the question: should the lenticular galaxy thread be divided up into two threads (i.e. a lenticular galaxy with rings thread and a lenticular galaxy without rings thread)? And to make matters worse, Kevin believes that we (i.e. human beings) have lumped many disparate types of objects that don't necessarily have anything in common with one another under one category which we have named 'lenticular galaxies'. I think you see where I'm going with this.

And then there's the problem of what to do with the polar ring galaxies in the "Ring Galaxy" thread, that you mentioned. What do we do with those? Do we create a separate thread for those as well?

And of course there is also the issue that only the zookeepers or the global moderators can make a thread into a sticky. So in the end, it would be up to them how the thread categories in the forum would be organized.

As for the "Ring Galaxy" thread as it stands now, who's going to sort through that terrible mess? I went through only 60 pages of approximately 260 pages of the "Ring Galaxy" thread in my search for pseudorings, only to give up after a couple of days in frustration because of the chaos in there. As of today, the galaxies that I have been posting in this thread are galaxies that I found while in Galaxy Analysis, classifying galaxies as I normally do.

I'm sure, Diaswa if you want to move your "ringed" galaxy posts from the "Ring Galaxy" thread to this one, the zookeepers would not have a problem with that. And, I would certainly welcome any contributions that you would like to make to this thread.

But as far as "cleansing" the "Ring Galaxy" thread of inappropriate postings, I'm afraid that would be an exercise in futility in which no one would want to partake. Besides all of the posts incorrectly uploaded to that thread, there is also a lot of replication of posts. Not all of our members check to see if an image has been posted before by someone else. And with new members joining Galaxy Zoo all of the time and other members dropping out after a time, it's quite literally a logistical impossibility to keep track of what members are doing in just the stickies alone.

I haven't requested that this thread be turned into a sticky, nor do I plan to in the future. But, please feel free to post images in here whenever you want. :)

Best regards,

Eric
« Last Edit: April 05, 2008, 03:19:36 am by EricFDiaz »

EricFDiaz

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #16 on: April 05, 2008, 04:55:08 pm »
This one is something very special. Why, you ask? Because it is a dwarf R'1 galaxy. Catching one so early in its formation can yield valuable insights into the formation of this type of galaxy--more so, I think, than more developed R'1 galaxies. At least, that's my opinion.

587730847960400171


This is a real gem!

(Image magnified)
« Last Edit: April 05, 2008, 05:05:02 pm by EricFDiaz »

waveney

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2008, 05:26:12 pm »
Eric,

That Dwarf has a distinct halo out beyond the "rings".
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EricFDiaz

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2008, 06:03:54 pm »
Eric,

That Dwarf has a distinct halo out beyond the "rings".

You know, I was so excited about finding this thing, Waveney that I didn't even take note of the halo. But, considering that this dwarf is being viewed at an oblique angle, the halo now seems quite apparent. And as we both know, halos are associated with spirals in the early stages of their development, which supports the hypothesis that this is a young R'1 galaxy. Is that your interpretation as well or am I missing something here?
« Last Edit: April 05, 2008, 06:25:36 pm by EricFDiaz »

waveney

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2008, 06:38:17 pm »
Eric,

That Dwarf has a distinct halo out beyond the "rings".

You know, I was so excited about finding this thing, Waveney that I didn't even take note of the halo. But, considering that this dwarf is being viewed at an oblique angle, the halo now seems quite apparent. And as we both know, halos are associated with spirals in the early stages of their development, which supports the hypothesis that this is a young R'1 galaxy. Is that your interpretation as well or am I missing something here?

I am no expert (just an awkward sole with a habit of asking questions and pointing out detail) I think it is an interpretation, there may be others.   I have been looking at the image in more detail, (when inverted) there is a hint of structure further out (on the right on the SDSS real image)
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EricFDiaz

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2008, 06:48:28 pm »
It would be nice to see a high-resolution Hubble image of this galaxy and see what's what. Oh well....such is life in the GZ. ;D ;D ;D

waveney

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #21 on: April 05, 2008, 07:31:05 pm »
One day, with GZ42, there will be a button labeled Hubble, that will automatically schedule Hubble to go and take high res images for us, such will be the fame of GZ.   ::) ::) ::)

Until then we will have to work with what we have.
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EricFDiaz

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #22 on: April 05, 2008, 08:39:40 pm »
One day, with GZ42, there will be a button labeled Hubble, that will automatically schedule Hubble to go and take high res images for us, such will be the fame of GZ.   ::) ::) ::)

Until then we will have to work with what we have.

ROFL waveney!  ;D ;D ;D

Now you're talking! ;)

Alice

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #23 on: April 05, 2008, 08:59:23 pm »
I wonder if anyone has thought of using Hubble to do a sky survey like SDSS's? I mean, how many pictures can Hubble take in the time that it takes the SDSS telescope to do as many?

EricFDiaz

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #24 on: April 05, 2008, 09:37:44 pm »
I wonder if anyone has thought of using Hubble to do a sky survey like SDSS's? I mean, how many pictures can Hubble take in the time that it takes the SDSS telescope to do as many?

Well, in a way the Hubble has done a sky survey, only the objects were much further away and much dimmer. The Hubble deep-sky surveys is to what I am referring. But, using the Hubble to survey objects that are as close as the one's surveyed by the SDSS telescope would be a waste of it's sensitivity and tremendous resolving power. And besides, time on the Hubble is very costly. So, the people at the Hubble Science Institute want to make sure that any proposal made by an astronomer to use the Hubble is worth the cost and time entailed in taking a look at something.

You have to remember, too, that Hubble was designed for some specific objectives which include but are not limited to cosmological questions (e.g. the type Ia supernova cosmology projects), galaxy evolution, investigation of dark matter, stellar deaths, just to name a few. I mean using the Hubble to do what the SDSS telescope does is like using a formula one racing car to drive to the store for groceries....it's just a waste of gas. LOL ;D ;D ;D

Now if an astronomer found a really interesting galaxy like the R'1 dwarf galaxy that I found today ::) ::) and could demonstrate that it was in fact a very significant object that could unravel some nagging questions about the universe, then Hubble Institute might let you have time on its space telescope to investigate further. But first they want to be convinced pretty conclusively that your project is worth the precious telescope time. Just look at how hard it is for astronomers to get precious telescope time on ground-based telescopes such as Keck. Can you imagine how much harder it is to get time on the Hubble?  ;)


Alice

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #25 on: April 05, 2008, 09:39:48 pm »
That makes perfect sense, Eric - thanks. :)

Enjoying reading your website by the way. The Galileo and Kepler links are also awesome.

EricFDiaz

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #26 on: April 05, 2008, 09:49:26 pm »
Thanks, Alice. I'm glad that you're enjoying the site. ;)

diaswa

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #27 on: April 06, 2008, 12:17:28 am »

I haven't requested that this thread be turned into a sticky, nor do I plan to in the future. But, please feel free to post images in here whenever you want. :)

Best regards,

Eric

Thanks for the thoughts, Eric.  I can see that such an untangling might take some effort.  I like to think of these various threads as "draft" catalogs of things that we zooites have found, so others can learn from and perhaps utilize for their own observations.

I will start moving my "ringed" candidates to this thread.  I suppose I should leave a note in the "ring" thread for any one else who might wonder what happened to my "ringed" entries.  I can remove these "move notes" later on and help cleanse the "ring" thread a bit.

regards, diaswa


diaswa

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #28 on: April 06, 2008, 12:36:26 am »
A ringed galaxy candidate.

Possible CW spiral, but a little too fuzzy to tell.

587742551213080594



diaswa

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Re: The Outer, Inner and Nuclear Ring and Pseudoring Phenomena
« Reply #29 on: April 06, 2008, 12:44:45 am »
Ringed galaxy candidate, barred CW spiral with a ring forming just outside the central bar. 

Also galaxy appears to overlap behind an elliptical galaxy on its SE arm.

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