Author Topic: A thread to talk about Talk  (Read 43098 times)

JohnF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3596
  • (Software Engineer, MBCS, MIET, FRAS, FBIS)
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2012, 04:49:59 pm »
:D I do like the fact that this forum was included in the new zoo.

Yep, it's very similar anyway :)


And Rick, agreed, I don't think Talk should go.. but I do think the forum is way better and if talk is the only option, I fear we'll lose people as they'll lose interest if nobody is answering their questions or if they can't find their questions back.

And besides a link to the home page of the forum and talk, I don't see how you can integrate them. They are very different.

Just my humble opinion by the way, not speaking as a mod or anything. ;)
Well, for what it's worth, I've been classifying galaxies in the new zoo, and using Talk.

And I HATE it!  :(

You can't follow anything interesting (unless it has a unique hashtag), and there's a veritable flood of 'threads' that are one post comments ... almost all of which will remain just that, one post comments. I even found that there are two, totally different, 'threads' on the 'red arc' that was found early on, and apparently no way for anyone to merge the two (they are both generating a fair number of new comments ... each!).

Why oh why did the zookeepers ever think Talk was better?!?  ???  >:(

Yes Jean, I see what you mean with 28 pages of Talk Threads started, the majority being one post threads.

If there was an Index of these Threads, like in the Galaxy Zoo forum, would that be better?
John C. Fairweather - http://www.jcfwebsite.co.uk

JohnF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3596
  • (Software Engineer, MBCS, MIET, FRAS, FBIS)
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #16 on: September 16, 2012, 04:36:39 pm »
I understand that Talk may be modified in the future, obviously suggestions are welcomed.
John C. Fairweather - http://www.jcfwebsite.co.uk

NGC3314

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1590
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #17 on: September 17, 2012, 12:53:15 pm »
I understand one reason to introduce Talk - which is that only a very small fraction of participants ever post on the Forum (or, as far as we can tell, read it). Talk gives a mechanism that is easier and more transparent to capture comments from such users. OTOH, how to search the Talk contents without a hashtag is something I've been in touch with development team members about.

JohnF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3596
  • (Software Engineer, MBCS, MIET, FRAS, FBIS)
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #18 on: September 17, 2012, 03:26:16 pm »
I understand one reason to introduce Talk - which is that only a very small fraction of participants ever post on the Forum (or, as far as we can tell, read it). Talk gives a mechanism that is easier and more transparent to capture comments from such users. OTOH, how to search the Talk contents without a hashtag is something I've been in touch with development team members about.

As I commented (among other matters) over the weekend in a PM, there are 28 pages of Talk threads in the new GZ, some are the duplicate of the same topic - perhaps there ought to be an topic index page and a Moderator could then assign the topic to the correct index page.
John C. Fairweather - http://www.jcfwebsite.co.uk

JeanTate

  • OotD posters
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2976
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #19 on: September 17, 2012, 04:32:50 pm »
There are actually 460 pages of Talk 'threads'  :o :o At least, in the last week; in the last day alone, 41. Of the >1 comment threads, you can't tell which you've already contributed/posted too (unless you kicked it off and/or you were the last to post) - at least no way that I know of. You also have no way of knowing which threads are duplicates, in the sense that someone started a discussion on a specific object, and someone else just filled in a few words under "What do you think?"

Oh, and what JohnF said too ...


Lovethetropics

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11196
  • I hunt Irregular galaxies And Hyper-Velocity Stars
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #20 on: September 17, 2012, 09:34:02 pm »
IMHO GZ Forum is perfect and "Talk" is NOT.  No threads, no help, too many irrelevant posts.  Not newbie friendly AT ALL.  Anyway can we start to talk about the new Zoo here and show what we got?  I refuse to use "Talk".

 *and find lots of asteroids  ;D

elizabeth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 33783
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #21 on: September 17, 2012, 09:44:23 pm »
I understand that Talk may be modified in the future, obviously suggestions are welcomed.
:) I just want to point out that " talk" has improved over last few years at least now you known if anyone is online ::)

JohnF

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3596
  • (Software Engineer, MBCS, MIET, FRAS, FBIS)
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #22 on: September 17, 2012, 09:51:31 pm »
I think when you see a page that has, as its title 'Page 1 of 71,880' (Recent Objects), you wonder what is going on - that is where you need an index
John C. Fairweather - http://www.jcfwebsite.co.uk

Hanny

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 17256
  • "Voorwerp kid"
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #23 on: September 18, 2012, 02:26:52 pm »
I understand one reason to introduce Talk - which is that only a very small fraction of participants ever post on the Forum (or, as far as we can tell, read it).

I understand you want to reach as many people as possible. And you're saying that not enough users are active on the forums, so it's indeed only logical you're thinking of another way to get them to share/ask things. However, did we ever directly link to the forum? I don't think so. Now I have to click 'no' for every picture I classify (which is a pain by the way, just have the button somewhere obvious, don't make it an obligated extra click). But yeah, since you do get asked directly to go to Talk (which was never the case for the forum), it's only logical more people will try it.

The real question is though: are they staying? ???

Talk gives a mechanism that is easier and more transparent to capture comments from such users.

I'm guessing you think this is the case, but don't have any proof if this (yet)? And I think the opposite: there are so many people saying it is NOT easy and/or transparrant at all! (And I also think that if actual users of Talk would understand how it works, we wouldn't have so many duplicate yet unanswered question threads on there!) As I just said, you will draw them to 'Talk' more, because there is now a link, but what if you had had the link to the forum (too)? How many people who go to Talk actually do think it's easy and stay?? And how many are you chasing away because there's nobody answering them and/or they can't find the thread?

If you do have numbers which proofs me wrong, I'll shut up, promise. ;)

OTOH, how to search the Talk contents without a hashtag is something I've been in touch with development team members about.

Good to hear it's still being discussed as this is indeed one of the many points which I think makes Talk not user friendly.

Just my two cents again. ;)

Hanny

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 17256
  • "Voorwerp kid"
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #24 on: September 18, 2012, 02:30:30 pm »
(We don't want older members contaminating the newbie
enthusiasm.)

No we don't. In fact, we care so much about the project that we're thinking along in ways to keep the new users. Us 'oldbees' can just use this place. We're worried for the future generation (see my previous comment to Bill). If proven wrong, and new users do think Talk is a success, I'm all for it. ;)

Hanny

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 17256
  • "Voorwerp kid"
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #25 on: September 18, 2012, 02:31:49 pm »
IMHO GZ Forum is perfect and "Talk" is NOT.  No threads, no help, too many irrelevant posts.  Not newbie friendly AT ALL.  Anyway can we start to talk about the new Zoo here and show what we got?  I refuse to use "Talk".

Yes, let's. :)

ElisabethB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13200
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #26 on: September 18, 2012, 04:59:25 pm »
IMHO GZ Forum is perfect and "Talk" is NOT.  No threads, no help, too many irrelevant posts.  Not newbie friendly AT ALL.  Anyway can we start to talk about the new Zoo here and show what we got?  I refuse to use "Talk".

Yes, let's. :)

But there are lots and lots of newbies with questions !  And it is really hard work, just trying to answer some of them.
Don't get me wrong, I'm no fan of Talk (to put it mildly, I've been very vocal about my utter dislike of it), but the fact that we now have both talk and the forum is not a good idea.
There will be a lot of duplicate threads, posts and discussions.
But what I find the saddest thing is that most of the oldbies are staying here While they could be helping a lot of people like when GZ2 came out, remember!
Okay, my top three of answers are : satellite trail, no they're stars and always classify what is i the centre of the image !  ;) ;D ;D
But it really helps people..
Having said this, I really, really don't like Talk and believe me I have been using it these last few days ! It needs a massive amount of work to make it useable for the zooites.  ::) ;D

Hanny

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 17256
  • "Voorwerp kid"
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #27 on: September 18, 2012, 05:08:31 pm »
Well put! As I said Els, our hearts are in the right place. ;) ;D :-*

elizabeth

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 33783
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #28 on: September 18, 2012, 08:02:26 pm »
IMHO GZ Forum is perfect and "Talk" is NOT.  No threads, no help, too many irrelevant posts.  Not newbie friendly AT ALL.  Anyway can we start to talk about the new Zoo here and show what we got?  I refuse to use "Talk".

Yes, let's. :)

But there are lots and lots of newbies with questions !  And it is really hard work, just trying to answer some of them.
Don't get me wrong, I'm no fan of Talk (to put it mildly, I've been very vocal about my utter dislike of it), but the fact that we now have both talk and the forum is not a good idea.
There will be a lot of duplicate threads, posts and discussions.
But what I find the saddest thing is that most of the oldbies are staying here While they could be helping a lot of people like when GZ2 came out, remember!
Okay, my top three of answers are : satellite trail, no they're stars and always classify what is i the centre of the image !  ;) ;D ;D
But it really helps people..
Having said this, I really, really don't like Talk and believe me I have been using it these last few days ! It needs a massive amount of work to make it useable for the zooites.  ::) ;D
Well put! As I said Els, our hearts are in the right place. ;) ;D :-*
:) I agree with you Els I also have been trying to help on the "talk" which is  very hard to use. It would be nice if some more of the old timers would help out but,  "talk" is very hard to use sometimes it drives me nuts.

Lovethetropics

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11196
  • I hunt Irregular galaxies And Hyper-Velocity Stars
    • View Profile
Re: A thread to talk about Talk
« Reply #29 on: September 18, 2012, 10:03:09 pm »
How about if we ask the Zookeepers to let us start a BIG thread like Hubble Zoo here and see if the newbies can find us here.  As "Talk" is right now it's not going to work.

 *and find lots of asteroids  ;D